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If you have no load (data )you can still use messenger in phil

Jackdn wrote:

If you have no load (data )you can still use messenger in phil

I won't have that issue but I wonder how that would work unless you use some sort of public wifi?

No public wifi just have a sim card like i have smart you run out of credit can still use messenger or face book free with no photos ...like i only get 50 piso of think 1 gb for 3 days and 1gb a day for etc you tube if run out still can message my girl on messenger no wifi

Good info to know Jackdn and welcome to the forum. we have used all of the above but mostly FaceTime as we are both iPhone users. 8 years ago it was Skype even though we were both iPhone 4 users then and knew little more than Skype. For us the best is FaceTime but I use messenger with my work colleagues with nary a problem, we have not used Skype or viber for 4 or 5 years, nothing wrong with them though from memory. The times are a changing.

Cheers, Steve.

Probably the only ones qualified to answer this question are people under 25 years old

Messenger according to my better half, then what's app but hey he is 29; interesting based on his opinion that we use FaceTime for years.
Are there any under 25's with an opinion?

Cheers, Steve.

FaceTime needs Wi-fi or Good LTE, loaf either way.
Messenger is free if no load - by far the most widely used messaging app.  Again paid (load consuming) apps go, Viber is fast losing ground to WhatsApp, IMO, line, wechat etc are minor players.

Pick a messaging app based upon which nation's intel agency you want spying on you.

Philippine Destiny wrote:

Pick a messaging app based upon which nation's intel agency you want spying on you.

Israel with WA, the linked one above, pokemon go supposed to be CIA, and very likely a lot more. I suppose the best bet is ignoring the whole spying thing and just getting on with life.

Fred wrote:

Philippine Destiny wrote:

Pick a messaging app based upon which nation's intel agency you want spying on you.

Israel with WA, the linked one above, pokemon go supposed to be CIA, and very likely a lot more. I suppose the best bet is ignoring the whole spying thing and just getting on with life.

seems Israel may be behind them all



"the best bet is ignoring the whole spying thing and just getting on with life."

What is your best argument as to why this should be simply ignored? Let me guess...because playing the paranoia card does not work in this case?

I see it this way, there's a grand total of nothing that can be done and, if they get shut down, the next one will arise to take their place.
We 're just pawns in a larger game so we might as well say " stuff it" and get on with life.

No paranoia exist when we know it happens.

So if you cannot use a messaging app for fear big brother is watching, just how can you communicate?  Phone calls, both mobile and landline, are definitely monitored as well as emails.  I guess you could always write it by hand, place it in an envelope and then hide it for pickup under a rock.
Just what is a terrorist, drug dealing, money laundering, child pornographer supposed to do these days. ?

AaronAardvark wrote:

So if you cannot use a messaging app for fear big brother is watching, just how can you communicate?  Phone calls, both mobile and landline, are definitely monitored as well as emails.  I guess you could always write it by hand, place it in an envelope and then hide it for pickup under a rock.
Just what is a terrorist, drug dealing, money laundering, child pornographer supposed to do these days. ?

A. No one said anything about fear.

B. No one said not to use anything.

C. You are the using the "if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear" argument. And that is always an invalid position. It is the  terrorists, drug dealers, money launderers and child pornographers that are providing these apps.

Being aware of these things and making sound decisions based upon knowledge of the risks and understanding of the options is what I advocate. Not ignoring them. The root of ignorance is ignore.

Civilians can and very often do get caught up in the crimes of those who are above the law.

Ignorance is ill advised.

after you get past the cognitive dissonance you'll act like you knew it all along

The question one is forced to ask is, "does big brother care?".
The idea of a police state's wet dream is mass surveillance in order to identify unusual behaviour, not looking at who you're meeting for lunch.

Fred wrote:

The question one is forced to ask is, "does big brother care?".
The idea of a police state's wet dream is mass surveillance in order to identify unusual behaviour, not looking at who you're meeting for lunch.

But you are making the mistake that all of these apps are equal and run by the same people with the same intent.

They are not.Some are more criminal than others.

And that is why educating yourself is important and that is why personal security is a responsibility that requires active participation and not passive acceptance of whatever comes.

And you never know what any particular "big brother" cares about. Sometimes they just want to steal your identity for whatever purpose.

Information security is not a monolithic world where only the good guys are looking at everything and for lawful purposes.

You can trust Iran or UAE or Peter Strzok if you want to. I think it is a bad idea.

I see it this way, I don't trust any of them so I stick to keeping an eye out for scammers and not sending my blood pressure up by worrying about what I can't do much about .... and is bugger all use to anyone anyway.
What is Mossad going to do with the message I sent to my daughter asking her if she wanted a burger or not?
That's the level of stuff they get hold of so I really have no care who reads it.
I'll post the text of my least 20 messages on here just in case the CIA wants to know about the land I'm thinking about buying, the arrangements for a WA video call with my mum, and the finer points of my daughter's lunch. It's earth shattering stuff, more so when she wants no pickle or onions on her burger.

Fred wrote:

I see it this way, I don't trust any of them so I stick to keeping an eye out for scammers and don't send my blood pressure up by worrying about what I can't do much about .... and is bugger all use to anyone anyway.
What is Mossad going to do with the message I sent to my daughter asking her if she wanted a burger or not?
That's the level of stuff they get hold of so I really have no care who reads it.
I'll post the text of my least 20 messages on here just in case the CIA wants to know about the land I'm thinking about buying, the arrangements for a WA video call with my mum, and the finer points of my daughter's lunch. It's earth shattering stuff, more so when she wants no pickle or onions on her burger.

"What is Mossad going to do with the message I sent to my daughter asking her if she wanted a burger or not?"

we are speaking in general terms

When you stick to banal information like that there is no issue.

The issues arise with more sensitive information. And there are some apps that you do not want to use at all.

That is why it is important to limit what is said and where it is said (which to a degree you say you already do).

And if only all of these apps behaved and did not reach over into other parts of your data wouldn't that be nice. It is not just about what you think you are typing into them. The fact that you think it is shows that you have a real vulnerability that you seem dead set against patching up.

I have a protonmail address, not because of the claimed security, more because it was a lot easier than setting up a new gmail, hotmail and Yahoo are crap, and I couldn't be bothered to search for a supplier I'd never heard of.
I use it for all the spam and general rubbish stuff that's likely to spam me, and for notifications from various sites I have no interest in receiving.
Once again, if the CIA or whomever fancy reading it, I have a new notifications or friends requests on the facebook page I only have so it's easier to read other facebook pages, or the blank Instagram I keep for the same reason, so they can fish all they like.

When you consider the CIA have access to all our passports, a new message on a FB group they can read anytime seems like nothing to care about.

If some state security agency reads my posts here or elsewhere, they'll find serious stuff about expatriation, lousy jokes, a bad attitude, a forum where I play a right wing nut job in order to study how the right wing think, and another where I play a lefty for the same, if opposite, reason.
They've find a fascist communist expat that loves and hates Trump, Boris, and Corbyn. I'm pro and anti China, pro and anti Russia, and whatever else I feel is required in order to get an idea of how any given group thinks. I'm also pro and anti Brexit, love and hate the EU, and think the sun shines out of Putin's backside, a man who will clear go to hell for his evil actions. I'm an Atheist Christian Muslim, once even a Buddhist.
All of that, and my real name and so on are nowhere, except you need an ID card to buy a SIM card or get an internet connection here so I suppose the local security services can track me any time they fancy, but I really don't care.

I've just googled myself, a chap that has regular newspaper reports about him and has been on radio and TV over here, but can't find a thing unless you type in the appropriate search parameters and know the name I use, and that isn't my real name as such.
I had a troll attack some years ago so I ghosted myself, even to the point of creating confusing paths for anyone searching for even a scrap of information would get a headache looking at, one leading one way, anther a totally different direction.
Even Mossad would have fun wading through that lot, if they ever decided to get interesting in a fat, slim, long haired, balding expat.

If James Bond is out there, read my profile for the truth.

Fred wrote:

I have a protonmail address, not because of the claimed security, more because it was a lot easier than setting up a new gmail, hotmail and Yahoo are crap, and I couldn't be bothered to search for a supplier I'd never heard of.
I use it for all the spam and general rubbish stuff that's likely to spam me, and for notifications from various sites I have no interest in receiving.
Once again, if the CIA or whomever fancy reading it, I have a new notifications or friends requests on the facebook page I only have so it's easier to read other facebook pages, or the blank Instagram I keep for the same reason, so they can fish all they like.

When you consider the CIA have access to all our passports, a new message on a FB group they can read anytime seems like nothing to care about.

If some state security agency reads my posts here or elsewhere, they'll find serious stuff about expatriation, lousy jokes, a bad attitude, a forum where I play a right wing nut job in order to study how the right wing think, and another where I play a lefty for the same, if opposite, reason.
They've find a fascist communist expat that loves and hates Trump, Boris, and Corbyn. I'm pro and anti China, pro and anti Russia, and whatever else I feel is required in order to get an idea of how any given group thinks. I'm also pro and anti Brexit, love and hate the EU, and think the sun shines out of Putin's backside, a man who will clear go to hell for his evil actions. I'm an Atheist Christian Muslim, once even a Buddhist.
All of that, and my real name and so on are nowhere, except you need an ID card to buy a SIM card or get an internet connection here so I suppose the local security services can track me any time they fancy, but I really don't care.

I've just googled myself, a chap that has regular newspaper reports about him and has been on radio and TV over here, but can't find a thing unless you type in the appropriate search parameters and know the name I use, and that isn't my real name as such.
I had a troll attack some years ago so I ghosted myself, even to the point of creating confusing paths for anyone searching for even a scrap of information would get a headache looking at, one leading one way, anther a totally different direction.
Even Mossad would have fun wading through that lot, if they ever decided to get interesting in a fat, slim, long haired, balding expat.

If James Bond is out there, read my profile for the truth.

You keep bringing up CIA and Mossad to distract from the point that there are a lot of other organizations out there putting out these apps for very specific criminal intent.

These Apps are a #1 vector for identity theft and other crimes and this is not a thing that people should argue against. Keeping an eye out for scammers will not be of any use when you install a back door on your device. The devices already have back doors from the factory. It is the aftermarket back doors like some of these messaging apps that should be avoided.

It is a fact that some of the state agencies putting these apps out are little more than organized crime syndicates.

Intel agencies are by nature secretive and underhand - Live with it because there is a grand total of sod all you can do about it.

Fred wrote:

Intel Live with it because there is a grand total of sod all you can do about it.

That is not true.

You do not have to ignorantly download a back door on to your device. And I will tell you again, this is not only about state agencies acting in the course of state activities. Hoards of criminals acting to enrich themselves and who are inside and outside of these agencies use the same exploits to commit crimes.

That's why I don't download games or apps I have no clue about onto my main phone. I have a second phone that's full of app I know to be invasive, or are potentially so, but that phone has nothing of use to anyone on it, unless they manage to steal 20 quid or so from an electronic payment app.

Fred wrote:

That's why I don't download games or apps I have no clue about onto my main phone. I have a second phone that's full of app I know to be invasive, or are potentially so, but that phone has nothing of use to anyone on it, unless they manage to steal 20 quid or so from an electronic payment app.

Which is the point of everything I have been saying. Millions of people download messaging apps never thinking about what those apps are doing and what privileges are allowed by default or otherwise. People need to be aware of the vulnerabilities that these apps present and they do have the power to choose not to use them or to choose other alternatives. Every word you speak or type into the ether is monitored and there is nothing you can do about that, but there are things you can do to limit your vulnerability to those who are doing it for nefarious intent.

Better to avoid Android, Windows, and ios - They all do it.

Watsapp viber it's great here sir thank you

And founder of Facebook   Suckerberg   is PROVEN scammer   

Everything is monitored, even and perhaps especially the likes of protonmail -- those you  hear from many people saying something as more "secure" and "offshore".   You  bets believe it's the opposite and most likely you got bamboozled.

I have lived here in the Philippines for over 6 years.

The top messenging apps are certainly FB Messenger, Viber, and then Whatsapp.  the majority of my contacts seem to be more active on Viber than Whatsapp.

Anyone who is on FB already (which is pretty much everyone) has Messenger integrated into their profile. They are more active on Messenger than actually using FB.

I hope this helps !

coach53 wrote:

And founder of Facebook   Suckerberg   is PROVEN scammer   

Facebook has its uses (I joined 2 really good Chromebook user groups) but it's not a platform you can trust in any way. Most groups get hammered with spammer and scammers, especially if you attempt any business of any sort.
One smell of money and your messaging service gets absolutely stuffed full of spam.
I put an temporary number on there a year or two back - Just believe me when I recommend you don't do the same with your real number.

Love or hate the founder really makes no difference - The platform in infested to the point it's useless for anything that matters.
One other point - Many platforms require sign ups require a date of birth - I use a fake one on everything that isn't a tax site or whatever. That information is used by banks to verify your identity and I don't want random companies to have it.

Scammer is an interesting description...  I would put it more like a Liberal Democrat Socialist who is against free Speech,  and the U.S.  Constitution.

It sounds like you have fallen into the trap laid out by very smart social manipulators everywhere. Once you take a side in any situation you are then subject to manipulation by anyone that wants to get you to do what they want and honestly you will rarely understand their motives entirely but they generally center around power and money; as such to actually speak freely is rare in todays world because most people have succumbed to picking a side and stop thinking about what really might be going on.  An example in a movie "Quantum of solace" not a great movie but this plot point is my example. The bad guys were dealing with the American government and wanted to by land in some remote area in Bolivia, I believe, and the government men said there is no oil there so OK. In reality the bad guys had a larger more involved plan that was about controlling water. Subterfuge and manipulation are the tools that rich people and large corporations use on a daily basis. Once you become comfortable with that reality, then it becomes much easier to speak freely. I am saying all of this because I fervently believe that people have to start thinking and stop reacting to manipulation. Rich people and large corporations have their own agenda and it rarely has anything to do with benefiting regular people. Another movie "smartest guys in the room" about Enron is a master's class in cooperate manipulation. Peace and love to all