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@Fandango2020 I do not know how your family situation is, but indeed USD 2200 for two should be more than sufficient for a lavish life. I budgetted (being careful) EUR 2700 pm. in practice it is far less EUR 2 K is more than sufficient. This includes EUR 500 for alcohol and cigaretts (3 packages per day).

@cdw057

LOL,, ,yeah  ours is cheaper..  we save the 500 because we don't drink

One of the most prominant factors motivating us to move is the absurd cost of healthcare here in the USA not to mention the spotty quality of healthcare.  That alone will reduce our budget drastically once we move.   Overall spending,  as Fandango2020 mentioned, is a fraction of what is required here in America.   However, on the flip side, I understand that the inflationary impact for the citizens of Turkey is not cushioned by the dollar and is much more consequential.  I have great sympathy for their suffering. 

@Gino_C

Healthcare in America

I paid $1500 a month because I make too much money and do not qualify for the Obama Care Robbery .   And still have to pay $2,500 deductabile per year per person before they  the insurance pays % 80 / % 20 .... it is a freaking Robbery of the American people.   it is way cheaper here it is unheard of.

Health care in Turkey, I would say not too bad, very good private insurance (I think for USD 500 pm (but I think too expensive for Turkey)), I try ti enroll for governement insurance (EUR 70 pm per person I think).

I can pay for medicines and smaller items, but being in a hospital with cancer, Covid, or serious items are a different matter,

No pleasure at all (no smoking, no drinking, no ...(I would be grateful in my bed with internet (audible notably, but also news))

Not to dwell too much on it but to emphasize the nature of US healthcare, a CNBC article from June 22 stated that 100 million adults in the US have health-care debt,12% owing $10,000 or more.  It is the number one reason for bankruptcies.  So that is a motivating factor for us.   

We have vacationed several times in Turkey and what draws us to want to move is the quality of life and its lively, engaging and friendly people.  We do intend to purchase a flat or villa and a car.  My suspicion is that our monthly expenses after that should be around $1500/month particularly since we live a modest lifestyle here in the US.   

@Gino_C If no smoking and drinking USD 1500 should be more than fine for a married couple, your health insurance should set you back around USD 250 pm for a couple I would think (with proper coverage). If no real need than it will be USD 10 I think, but no coverage really for cancer, heart attacks etc.

@cdw057

Thanks for your confirmation that $1500 is a fair budgeted number. But your other comment about healthcare of $250 for a couple leads me to another question: in another topic, you posted that you believe its better to enroll in SGK health insurance rather than privately. I'm not familiar with SGK . Is the $250 cost you mention SGK insurance and if you don't mind explaining the drawbacks/benefits of each.

Also, you had mentioned that you are semi retired with no pension currently. I am in the same position. Eventually, I will be collecting social security. As a non-citizen resident of Turkey, do I have to declare that income source and be taxed on it?

Thanks in advance.

SGK is much cheaper, not easy to enroll and service seems to be not too good as I understand.

As I understand you just have to have your Ikamet and be resident for a year, but we abandoned the plan to go for SGK.

Do I have to pay tax on my pension earned from overseas as a non citizen resident of Turkiye? Thank you

@abba1405 One of the concerns I have, if you have Ikamet it also comes with duties (tax notably), typically pension from overseas will be in the higher bracket. One of the reasons to consider leaving Turkey before I reach retirement age (now we live just from capital and no income).

I am now 60+ so I have a few more years, things change quickly though.

So to qualify, once someone has Ikamet they automatically have to pay taxes on their private pension paid into a UK bank account?

I currently pay

£12000 tax free  pa

£17000 at 20% pa

I had assumed I would cintinue to oay UK tax and xould transfer funds as and when required.

it is better to ask a Turkish accountant.   It does not make sense to pay Turkey taxes on income or pension derived from your original country.  This income or pension is already taxed over there. and it was not earned in Turkey.  Why would Turkey have any Tax rights to this resource?   this is a JOKE

@marktmorgan Practical question, how to declare, if I have to pay, I have to pay, but how do you do this?

Admittedly I have a difficult situation and I have to gather things when time comes (private pensions, Netherlands official, UK possibly, Luxembourg, Hungary), as I understand under EU rules, the last country with a full year employment should collect and arrange (in my case Hungary (I do not speak Hungarian at all)

The communication between a Dutch man receiving (hopefully) pension and Hungarian authorities will be interesting (to say the least), communication to Turkish authorities after will also be a challenge.

No concern for now, but ...

Pension is fine (perhaps too fine), lets see if I live to that age.

But also and perhaps especially an interesting for my wife.

Luxembourg is great for pensions, if I am dead, still my wife is entitled.

@Fandango2020 Unfortunately not completely true, partially though but... I really consider moving before retirement age (I do not where to but)

@Fandango2020 world wide income remains important

@cdw057 we are thinking to move out of Turkiye..  it does not seem to be a stable living here due to the off the walls rules they come up with and no longer appreciate all the money we bring and spend in here..   Pretty crazy, and I think they are ruining the economy and pushing just about everyone out   !!!!! !!!!   what the heck they expect us to do but to look for another country that appreciates expats.

@cdw057 we are thinking to move out of Turkiye.. it does not seem to be a stable living here due to the off the walls rules they come up with and no longer appreciate all the money we bring and spend in here..  Pretty crazy, and I think they are ruining the economy and pushing just about everyone out !!!!! !!!!  what the heck they expect us to do but to look for another country that appreciates expats.
-@Fandango2020

I am seriously considering becoming an expat in Turkiye in about 2 years so if you don't mind, could you please expand on your comment on the off the walls rules they impose as well as any specific things which are hassles for expats causing you to consider moving out? Is this applicable only to your situation?  Thanks Fandango

nothing specific with my situation, it is just what i hear.   They do not give residency visa anymore if you don't own an apartment or a house,  and if they approve it, if you submitted for 2 years, you might get 1 year visa

and if you have kids, they might not give them 6 month or not give them at all.   or they give your you and wife and not give one of your kids visa..  pretty strange !???  ... this was not the case before.  they were very nice but now, they tell you, " we dont have to give you any visa at all"    please don't take my words only, do confirm with other people you may know and living in Turkey.

@Gino_C I do not know what happens in the near future, Turkey seems to be more Western oriented. At this stage for people renting situation (even Germans) seems to be difficult, I even heard about difficult for situations owning a property.

Personally I think Erdogan will like to protect economy (even without Russia), I think things will change (the 20/25% rule and more globally residency permit (who knows)

A strong clamp down on refugees (Syria, Iran, Iraq), but I think there will be better admittance for EU (or US etc), nobody can say, things are changing, question is it also for people with enough money to spend???

Relatively positive, but worried at the same time.

@cdw057 Yup!   expats are waiting for the shoe to drop anytime now.   People are selling their houses but no Buyers at the moment.  everyone is worried about the uncertainity.     Even rentals now is way too high..  10,000 TL  and higher per month .  2 bedrooms used to rent for 800 TL now, you will be lucky and fortunate if you can get it for  10,000 TL in Alanya

@Fandango2020

The Turkish economic and political situation is getting dicey for sure and it is still evolving towards some end, but for retired expats like me, my primary concern would be getting my residence permit (ikamet) without interruption.  I have 2 years before I make my move (if I do) so I have the luxury of seeing how it all plays out. 

In regards to residency permits, an expat had posted last year that Turkey has instituted a law or policy which closes off residence permits to neighborhoods whose immigrant population exceeds 20% of the residents.  I have not seen any updates in this matter.  But in my research, I came across the official website for the Turkish President of Migration Management which might be useful to many people:

@Gino_C   it is true. some cities are closed to new permits in Alanya.. like Mahmutlar, Kestel and Kargicak

it is still oepn in OBA and Demirtas.   however, to purchase apartment in the open cities the value has to be $75,000 or higher.  some low density cities are set for $50,000 or higher.   meaning, OBA and Demirtas it has to be $75,000 or higher to get ikamet in OBA and Demirtas.     however, if you are an American they may still give your residency in OBA or Demirtas if you rent.  not so in Mahmutlar , Kestel and Kargicak.   don't know what it will be like in 2 years from now.  best of luck regardless.

@Gino_C I of course do not know your level of pension, but it is main of the reasons to leave Turkey before retirement age (levels can be 35%). I do not want to receive any (interest) income at this stage, declaration, accountant etc (capital gains also some concern).

SGK you are eligible after 1 year of Ikamet, yes we pay too much to a private company (we have to see on services, but easy and presented services are excellent (expensive as mentioned EUR 210 pm). We did not go for SGK (lazy, we do not speak Turkish, ..)

Going back income/capital gain are an issue for concern.

Just hypothetical, you came to Turkey with a pension paying out one off, capital gains in USD or EUR can be limited, but measured in TRY can be the full amount??

Same for property (as I understand however after 5 years it is free (and before proportionally (if selling after 4 years 20% taxes). Officially on TAPU value (which typically is far, far too low) can be challenged. (conclusion some concerns or considerations)

@Fandango2020 implicit indication that things could be better

@Gino_C I of course do not know your level of pension, but it is main of the reasons to leave Turkey before retirement age (levels can be 35%). I do not want to receive any (interest) income at this stage, declaration, accountant etc (capital gains also some concern).
SGK you are eligible after 1 year of Ikamet, yes we pay too much to a private company (we have to see on services, but easy and presented services are excellent (expensive as mentioned EUR 210 pm). We did not go for SGK (lazy, we do not speak Turkish, ..)
Going back income/capital gain are an issue for concern.
Just hypothetical, you came to Turkey with a pension paying out one off, capital gains in USD or EUR can be limited, but measured in TRY can be the full amount??
Same for property (as I understand however after 5 years it is free (and before proportionally (if selling after 4 years 20% taxes). Officially on TAPU value (which typically is far, far too low) can be challenged. (conclusion some concerns or considerations)
-@cdw057

You bring up good points to consider. I too have no pension currently and through the years have been investing in the stock market. I had presumed that dividends/capital gains or Social Security, when I start collecting, would not be taxable by the Turkish government as I am a US citizen and will be filing my taxes with the IRS. This requires further research on my part so that I understand the financial landscape I will operate in when I move to Turkey. As Fandango stated it is absurd for Turkey to tax my financial activities occurring the US for which I will pay taxes to the IRS (The US government).

As a side note, I have heard that ikamet is open to people who are moving from the US or EU. I do intend to purchase a flat which strengthens my position in being granted residency. Also, thanks CDW057 for keeping the MB active with important and relative comments which add value to members like me.

I am happy that somebody appreciates tax-risk. Quite some (rightfully in my view) atenttion to (pro government site) to attack tax-avoidance

assuming auto translate

We live here with Ikamet, we paid taxes where we can. I think it is important to do everything we have to do (property taxes, health insurance, electricty and water are easy (but it has to be arranged), we were worry in two months time (we will get support (paid))

Good if to have your own property and Ikamet (very limited taxes), of course there will be challenges, but just buy your support and things will be fine.

This topic seems to havd gone off track somewhat into pensions, healthcare and property.

Yes I appreciate that these are the BIG ticket items.

This link is useful, or at least was to me:

@marktmorgan I personally think it is not got out of line, for me personally tax is part of cost of living and could be very big (numbeo does not consider this)

If in a few years time I have to pay 35% if will impact my expenses (quite a bit)

To ignore these type of expenses is not good (again no concern right now, but in the near future)

Apologies to disagree, but to me it is not off topic at all.

What will you be paying 35% tax on?

@marktmorgan I am not German (I am Dutch), as I understand (currently) tax authorities will not look at an annual income (for Germans) as a pensioner below EUR 10 K annually (most of them), but above and also partially inclusive the 10K (free tax is extremely low in Turkey)  you will pay (just as I understand the 35%)

Between Germany and Turkey there seems to be a friendly bilateral agreement. I think for other countries it is probably more strict, DTT sounds nice but in practice it does not value (not anyhow in Turkey)

Again it is a financial concern, but a serious one (for me).

I knew you were Dutch 😉

So my £30k UK pension paid into a UK account and then with a monthly transfer of say £1500 intona turkish bank will be taxed by Turkey?

Similarly will the £300k from my hoise sale be subject to Turkish tax. Typically in thw UK younare not taxed onnthe lump sum bit the interest.

If

Non-Turkish people do not pay income tax in Turkey for the earnings collected from abroad, no matter they have residency or not, unless they work here in Turkey, where income tax should be paid by employers.

If you have realty, you will have to pay property tax. If you have rental revenue, you have to issue declaration and pay income tax.

@Borraro I challenge that, but OK no problem for now. I did some interesting articles though on Alanya news.

Anyhow, people renting out should also pay taxes and so are retirees.

No taxes paying is not honest and not applicable, please say what you will, I am still scared. Can you give an official quote? I Do not think you can.

@Borraro I do not have any rental revenue, we live here full time, but I do not trust your reply, please give me an article that people who receive EUR 30 K + have to pay nothing.

@cdw057 I do have google translate

@marktmorgan A worry woul be change of information (fine for me), but I am sure for UK bank you will have given some info on the Turkish tax number. Information can be slow, but it will come.

How can I find an artcle about something which does not exist? Do you have opposite on hand?

Find a financial advisor then..

@Borraro For the forum, could you say at the current situation that you would cover for any pension payments? (I do not think so), just give the official statement that pensioners do not have to pay on their payments.

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