½ûÂþÌìÌÃ

Really, you should provide a lot more info......

How old is the car (years and months, date of first registration)?  How far has it been driven? Is it a model of car that can be easily found in Hungary or Hungary?  What size engine and fuel type? Are you just driving it temporarily and do you want to take it back at the end of your visit?   Or do you want the car to stay here forever? Do you own the car outright with complete documentation?  Do you have a Hungarian passport?   Do you have a Canadian passport? Will you apply for a residence permit?  How long will the car stay in Hungary (exactly)?

Well if you plan to bring it over and use it for 6 months then take it back with you, you must be made of money because it will be costly, even bringing it over and leaving it here, unless you know someone, where it can stay and get turned over from time to time, could be a waste of a good car. If you don't know anyone storing it could be a bit pricey. Because you would need it to be stored somewhere, leaving out I would expect to find it on your return.

Hi and welcome to the Forum.

I've just read your profile; it tells me that both you and your wife are Hungarian citizens who are returning home from an extended stay abroad.  My advice is to use Google to find a shipping company that you can talk to about shipping your car and household possessions from Canada to Hungary.  In general, if your car and household goods are "normal", so not antique, valuable, not any prohibited item (i.e. restricted animal-based); the shipping company can probably offer you advice on that sort of thing.  When I've shipped a car in the past, I always used an ISO container and then filled the car and any space left with the stuff I was taking with me.

Warning - it's not cheap and US-spec cars are hard to operate in Europe (different spec, parts).  You may have to pay taxes depending on age, value and emissions.  Most people find it's cheaper to sell the car in Canada and buy one when you get to where you're going to live.  I only shipped mine because my boss was paying.

Hope this helps.

Cynic
Expat Team

Cynic wrote:

.....
Warning - it's not cheap and US-spec cars are hard to operate in Europe (different spec, parts).  You may have to pay taxes depending on age, value and emissions.  Most people find it's cheaper to sell the car in Canada and buy one when you get to where you're going to live.  I only shipped mine because my boss was paying.

Hope this helps.

Cynic
Expat Team

Not entirely accurate. I have an old North American model car and it's a model which was sold in Europe.   I can buy nearly all the usual maintenance parts relatively easily here - spark plugs, oil filters, batteries are easy. Some parts are the same on other vehicles.   It depends on what kind of a car it is.  Spare parts are mutual recognised.  Big items like gearboxes or engines or axles or body parts are harder  to find but not impossible.   

The rule usually applied on importing vehicles is that if it's older than 6 months, has been driven some distance (forgotten the amount, few thousand km), it's considered secondhand and part of your possessions, then you can import it as personal goods for your household.  There should be no import duty or VAT to pay on it.   The amount of registration fees to pay can be calculated using an online calculator - easy to find with Google.  Note that VAT and import duty are not the same as registration fees.   One can be hit very hard on registration fees as cars from North America tend to have weak, oversized and emission generating engines (particularly diesels).  North America has traditionally shunned diesel cars so there should be no problem with current thinking.   All EU policy is now to charge registration fees on polluting potential (i.e. now all against diesels).   

Note that the car from North America will not have an EU CoC (Certificate of Conformity) meaning it was not built for European traffic regulations. If there was a  CoC then it would be registered without inspection if so desired.   If the model was the same as one here, then they may be less concerned by the lack of a CoC if they can find it in their model lists.

For the most part a CoC is not a particularly a problem but might mean minor modifications but it very much depends on the specific  vehicle.

Examples: US cars may have a speedometer in mph but European cars may have both or just kph.  Canadian cars will be in kph so no problem there.  Other areas of problems - no rear fog lights (EU requirement), headlight design (US regulations are strange on glass vs plastic), side indicators/turn signals (EU requirement) and usually presence of hood ornaments or bull bars (should be removed) (safety standards) and seat belts (must be fitted to all seats).  There's an odd one on the colour of turn signals.  Sometimes NA cars have clear lenses and orange bulbs.  That is very uncommon in European cars - always orange indicators.    Batteries are a strange one.  North American batteries have reversed terminals to most European cars but not totally impossible. Some Japanese cars have the terminals around the wrong way too.  In my own car, I found a US style Bosch battery fairly easily.   Size was a bit different but close enough to spec.

But the main issue is the registration fee - a 10 year old 6 litre diesel Hummer is going to cost you plenty but a 2 year old 2 litre Kia isn't going to really cost a massive amount.

Older cars are certainly easier; my experience is that the moment you have a car with an ECU, then you have issues with mixing sensors that are set up for different parameters and cause issues with emissions to the extent that you may have to replace the ECU and any associated sensors to make it all work together.  The only car I ever had that just worked was an old Toyota 4x4 that was built to Japanese spec.

Whatever my advice stands, speak to the company you intend to use to ship your personal effects, then there are no nasty surprises.

Just to add - something just came back to me.  P&O used to operate a RO-RO service between Halifax (NS) and Rotterdam; we used to put a lot of North American vehicles on there; the owners would plan their own itinerary to get to Holland to pick up their car on arrival and then drive it to their onward destination.  A lot cheaper than having it freighted all the way - food for thought.

Cynic wrote:

Older cars are certainly easier; my experience is that the moment you have a car with an ECU, then you have issues with mixing sensors that are set up for different parameters and cause issues with emissions to the extent that you may have to replace the ECU and any associated sensors to make it all work together.  The only car I ever had that just worked was an old Toyota 4x4 that was built to Japanese spec.

Whatever my advice stands, speak to the company you intend to use to ship your personal effects, then there are no nasty surprises.

Just to add - something just came back to me.  P&O used to operate a RO-RO service between Halifax (NS) and Rotterdam; we used to put a lot of North American vehicles on there; the owners would plan their own itinerary to get to Holland to pick up their car on arrival and then drive it to their onward destination.  A lot cheaper than having it freighted all the way - food for thought.

There's no problem with ECUs in NA cars in Europe.  All cars from the past 20-25 years have ECUs.  There's standard for it - ECE - which is linked to the pollution controls and the Euro rating.   

I've had a number of NA vehicles and the ECU has never been a problem.   The fuel types can be slightly different but if anything I've found most petrol cars from NA take lower octane fuel unleaded that's available in Europe.  I've been putting in 95 rated petrol in my car for many years and it runs fine and meets all the emissions standards.   Japanese cars are a bit strange - they can have different fuel filler pipes sizes.   

The main issue is the Euro standard which ECE demands an ECU must be present and certain bands of pollution control.  You get punished on registration fees if your car falls into say Euro 3 or less.   Anything less than Euro 2 or Euro 1 is unlikely to be accepted for registration unless it's a classic car of some description as the pollution levels are is too high.  The current standard is Euro 6.

An unusual feature with my car is that it could take E10 (which is petrol with 10% ethanol) way before it was actually available in Europe.  And it had California emissions standard too. In my mind it was more advanced than European standards.

My Canadian friends brought cars here in the way you described.  It wasn't that expensive 15+ years ago.  Surprisingly cheap actually.   It's quite difficult for EU citizens.  Usually a foreign, non-EU passport is required to drive away from Rotterdam but should be OK if it's temporarily imported.   Insurance for non-EU cars is necessary (it's compulsory).

There are all sorts of localised restrictions on EU citizens that are resident in a particular country driving foreign cars from outside that country.

Interesting - thank you.  You may have just given me an idea for my retirement project that I had discarded as I thought I was going to encounter what I had before.

With regards to ro-ro'ing the car over, very much depends on what he imports the car as; if it's temporary/transit into or through the Netherlands, he may get a document check - but mostly you just find your vehicle on the lot, pay the port fees, get your keys and off you go.  If Dutch customs have a problem with it, it will have been impounded until they are resolved and you won't even get in the yard until that's done; hence my advice about talking to the shipper, they do this all the time and will know what's currently going on in the port.  He needs to ensure that his Canadian auto-insurance covers him for what he's doing up until the time he gets back to Hungary.

Cynic wrote:

Interesting - thank you.  You may have just given me an idea for my retirement project that I had discarded as I thought I was going to encounter what I had before.

With regards to ro-ro'ing the car over, very much depends on what he imports the car as; if it's temporary/transit into or through the Netherlands, he may get a document check - but mostly you just find your vehicle on the lot, pay the port fees, get your keys and off you go.  If Dutch customs have a problem with it, it will have been impounded until they are resolved and you won't even get in the yard until that's done; hence my advice about talking to the shipper, they do this all the time and will know what's currently going on in the port.  He needs to ensure that his Canadian auto-insurance covers him for what he's doing up until the time he gets back to Hungary.

It's good advice. 

The Canadian insurance will almost certainly not be valid but there is a possibility to get insurance in Europe but there's quite a premium for it.   

When I brought my hobby car in from Canada I had to provide my passport and even though I am an EU-citizen, at the time the rules were less developed and I had my residence permit.  I took the car directly to Hungary which at the time was not in the EU.  That seemed to satisfy them at the time.  Dutch are sticklers for procedure.

If someone wants to bring in a car just make sure it's a model which exists here plus all the other things I mentioned before.  The inspection process has improved (more procedural and rigorous)  since EU accession.

I guy I knew brought in a classic car for restoration and found that he couldn't register it at all.  Had to ship back to Canada. I think it had Nevada plates or something like that.

Do you know if one can ship a ship a car from Seattle (USA) to Hungary.  About how much would cost likely be? How much would Hungarian registration and licensing be?

evacarleton wrote:

Do you know if one can ship a ship a car from Seattle (USA) to Hungary.  About how much would cost likely be? How much would Hungarian registration and licensing be?

Shipping will be a  few thousand US dollars - it would be containerised.  If it's your personal goods then you should not need to pay any import duties but you will need an agent to handle it.  From Seattle, I would think at 8 to 10 weeks to arrive in Rotterdam or Hamburg,  You can drive it back from there but it's mandatory to have insurance.

HU registration taxes, inspections and all that depends on the car itself.

Please give the model, engine size, fuel type, age etc to give an indication because the registration taxes are based on these factors.  These determine the pollution potential.  All EU based car taxes are pollution based. 

If you are coming for years, it might be worth it for a special car, but if not and it's a very ordinary car, it's not really worth doing.  On the other hand, cars are expensive here relatively and the secondhand market has many untrustworthy sharks.

Just to back up what Fluffy has said, this will be expensive and unless it's something really special, then perhaps consider selling it and getting a new one that conforms to the EU standards when you get there.

From my experience, the nearest west coast shipping point to Europe is from Tacoma in the US.  You may find it cheaper to drive/ship it to the east coast and look at shipping from Montreal/Halifax, you will also find roll-on/roll-off services there where they drive the car on the ship without containerisation - that's how they move new cars from the US to Europe and vice-versa; unfortunately, you can't travel with it.

Other options; if you're moving your entire household, then perhaps get a door to door container service and then pack your soft/fragile goods in and around your car.  The cheapest option will be you drive it to the port of loading, then pick it up from the European port in Germany or the Netherlands, this will almost certainly involve cross European border driving, so you need to consider your car insurance and check with your insurer if you are covered and can they issue a European green card insurance document.

This will take you to a website from the company I used to work with, it lists the schedules from North America to Europe.  There will be other companies who do this, a few minutes spent on Google will show these.

Hope this helps.

Cynic
Expat Team

Cynic wrote:

Just to back up what Fluffy has said, this will be expensive and unless it's something really special, then perhaps consider selling it and getting a new one that conforms to the EU standards when you get there.

...

Great information...

Just to add 2cts/2 HUF more, if the car is one generally sold internationally, then spare parts are usually interchangeable. 

My North American car was relatively easy to source parts for but it's becoming more difficult. Small routine stuff is remarkably easy to get but major things are becoming quite difficult. I need a rear axle for my hobby car but this is becoming almost impossible to find. 

I was also looking at buying a second hand US police interceptor (Crown Victoria) but the costs of shipping and spare parts are going to be high.  Only way to get one is to do it at a US auction to lower the capital costs.

Unless it is a very, very  special car do not do it, but I suppose you already made your calculations for transport as a minimum, additionial headache and taxes in Hungary will only add.
Perhaps you are a millionaire, but for a few months only (or full residency) I would say do not do it.

My conclusion, scam, naive or millionaire. Anyhow do your research for the latter you can have other people to do it for you).

Sceptical on the post to say the least.

cdw057 wrote:

Unless it is a very, very  special car do not do it, but I suppose you already made your calculations for transport as a minimum, additionial headache and taxes in Hungary will only add.
Perhaps you are a millionaire, but for a few months only (or full residency) I would say do not do it.

My conclusion, scam, naive or millionaire. Anyhow do your research for the latter you can have other people to do it for you).

Sceptical on the post to say the least.

For a few months (actually less than 6) then it could be worth it if it's a fantastically good or special car.  It just depends on how much people really like the car.   For hobbyists, all reality on value goes out the window.

Classic cars are not bad to import as by age they have almost no residual value but one gets clobbered on the pollution registration tax as they will never meet the Euro pollution standards.  Old timers (>30 years) are another thing.

There's a very odd thing about the Euro standards and that relates to California emissions standards which are very high indeed.   It makes no difference to the EU (and Euro  standards) if the North American car has the "California " package or not.   I've been in that argument with the HU registration people.   

If the car is also made or sold in Europe, they use that version as the model to classify it.  They do not really check the car at import but it does need to pass the HU version of the EU emissions test.  No points for California.

BTW, perceived value can obviously vary.  We were in my hobby car in the McDonalds drive in last night and we were behind a German registered sporty looking Tesla - presumably imported from the USA.   Very smart looking car indeed.  Really nice and sleek - very much like top end Mercedes or BMW.  But we could see the body panels don't line up properly.  Left hand side was at least 2-3mm lower than the right hand side. Ruined its lines.  I've read this is a common problem on Tesla cars - poor finishing (or bad repairs).  And that's on a $100K+ car.  I cannot see that being consumer acceptable on any car built in a European factory.