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@Mbershod

It will be far more complicated than you ever dreamed.聽 Even for "worldly, multilingual, educated" couples.聽 Hire consultants and buckle your seatbelts

Thanks鈥�what specific issues did you run into?

@Mbersho

My wife and I are 70-ish. We just bought a townhouse in the small town of Diamuz, a mile from a gorgeous beach on the Mediterranean. It is near the larger town of Gand铆a, both about 1.5 hours south of Valencia and 1 hour north of Alicante. The sellers are a gay couple from NZ who have to go back because of one father鈥檚 illness. Our realtor, part of a lesbian couple, is terrific. I can give you more info and contact info if you like. We鈥檙e going there in December. There鈥檚 a separate guest suite if you鈥檇 be interested in renting that. Best regards, Bob

I saw the post about complications. We also have a great Spanish attorney who has handled all of that for us. We鈥檝e had no problems.

@Mbershod

Don鈥檛 forget Catalunya region, not cold in winter and warm but not blazing hot like in southern spain. We have lived here for 3 years now and love the fishing village atmosphere yet being close to Barcelona (50 minutes by train..)

@njadwriter Hi, thanks for the info. This would be a huge leap for us and a bit scary. Not sure if we decide to take the plunge, do we just sell everything we own here in the States or ship things over? We also have our cat who will be coming with us and that is one of our major concerns.聽 At 67 we鈥檙e afraid if we don鈥檛 made the move now we鈥檙e never going to do it. 鈽癸笍

@Mbershod

East of Alicante is very, very wet, I don't recommend it. :-)

Alicante is a great city and the Costa Blanca is lovely, so there are plenty of nice beach-adjacent spots both in and outside the city.

Spain has lots of coastline and a whole bunch of famous Costas, you are really spoiled for choice! You can look at the cities (Marbella, Malaga, Alicante, Valencia, Tarragona, Barcelona, Bilbao, etc.) or you can find many delightful beach towns nearby (e.g. Sitges near Barcelona, Calp near Alicante/Valencia). They're all good, so you'll probably be fine if you just want to pick one. But you might find it easier to rent something small first, and then spend some time travelling around Spain and exploring before you make a final decision/big purchase.

Take a look at Idealista to see what you can get for your money in Alicante... and all parts of Spain. Just be aware that beach places are, like everywhere, busier (especially in summer) and more expensive. We live just inland from Alicante city in Elche, a lovely UNESCO-listed city with a historic centre, famous palm groves, and a super river/riverside walk that runs through it. The downside is that we've got a 15 minutes drive to the beaches... the upside is that our apartment cost a fraction of the price of comparables in ritzy Playa San Juan in Alicante.

For a retired couple, the NLV is pretty straightforward, so I don't see why there should be any major complications moving over.

Have fun you crazy kids!

Good morning, on our last trip we explored Estepona, definitely not where we want to be, really really hot and that was in June plus one day it was extremely windy. We have been working with a realty company based out of San Pedro, but of course like any realtor they would hope that you would buy something. Unfortunately we are not in the financial position to make a purchase with also owning our condo here in S. Florida. We had met some folks in Alicante on our first trip last November and they had mentioned Denia, other than that we know nothing about it so we appreciate your insight.聽 I鈥檓 also concerned about that area due to the recent flooding catastrophe that happened outside of Valencia.聽 One of our main priorities on choosing a place to live would be the proximity of healthcare facilities as well of course grocery stores and gyms. At 67 we鈥檙e feeling like we might have missed the boat to make this big of a move but due to the political climate here in the States not sure we can stay here鈥�.鈽癸笍

@Mbershod

When we told our kids what we were doing their response was 鈥測ou鈥檙e too old.鈥� My response was 鈥渨e鈥檙e too old not to do it.鈥�

The townhouse we bought included all the furniture, so that was not an issue for us. My guess is it would be very expensive to ship furniture to Spain. The global situation including the attacks by Houthis in the Red Sea have made shipping even more expensive. We are also bringing our cat to Spain. Not very complicated. Needs up to date rabies shot, a newer chip, and a health certificate completed within 10 days of travel. We鈥檙e flying United and can keep him in his carrier at our seat. Charge is $150 and United limits pets to six per flight.

@njadwriter I know, if we don鈥檛 do it now we鈥檙e never going to do it.聽 We have collected so much over the years can鈥檛 even imagine where to start. In regards to shipping stuff, how do you even decide what or what not to take . We also have a cat, who is afraid of her own shadow so that is causing me great concern. It鈥檚 hard enough for us to be on a plane that long.聽 Would love to see some pics of the area you鈥檙e in

You really shouldn't be thinking of moving huge amounts of stuff. Freight rates are incomprehensible now. You would probably be able to replace the stuff you have, new, without the agony of the shipping, buying locally.

But get a quote. Would be interested to hear. I recently needed documents urgently from the usa - letter size envelope. 2 day on DHL. $190. 7 pages.

@Mbershod,

You did not miss the boat because of your age.

I am 67 & just arrived in Valencia, Spain on a NLV from the U.S.

And, I brought my beloved 17 year old cat with me (in the cabin

of the plane). She did fine.

I am renting a lovely furnished apt. in a great part of town for a year.

I shipped mostly artwork & sentimental items, some clothing &

(thankfully) some of my better kitchen ware, & one small dresser via

sea freight (which hasn鈥檛 arrived yet).

I checked in 3 large suitcases, had a carry-on & my cat, in addition to

my disassembled packed bike. Yes, it was logistically very difficult doing

that solo. But it can be done, and you are a couple鈥攎uch easier.

I say strike while the iron is hot. Apply for your visas & get out of there!

DM聽 me if you have any other questions.

@rdruby699 Hi, thanks for the encouragement鈥�My partner is ready to go, I鈥檓 the one who is hesitant especially since we really don鈥檛 know where to settle even if it鈥檚 only temporary.聽 Not sure about your cat but ours hates to even get in her carrier to go to the vet. I think if we made the trip with her we would have to look at taking a direct flight out of Miami rather than put her through connecting flights. And talk about 鈥渟tuff鈥濃��we have a lot! Oh and neither one of us speaks Spanish although I knew a few words.聽 The other hiccup we have is selling our condo here鈥�.the timing would have to be right otherwise Spain taxes the capital gains from $1

@Mbershod

I have lots of pictures but I can鈥檛 figure out how to get them on this platform. For a general sense of the area just do a search for Gandia, Spain. The coast on the Mediterranean runs all the way from Barcelona to Rock of Gibraltar. You can also use VRBO to search rentals in Daimuz. But must if those are Miami-like condos and could be anywhere. The Realty Company we used is happy2spain.com and the agent is Vanessa. I just took a look and there are a bunch of listings. If you鈥檙e also on WhatsApp I can send you my photos that way. Believe it or not, the other way to bring kitty is on the QE2. There is a kennel on board. From UK you can take trains to Spain. Do it before you think of all the reasons you shouldn鈥檛. That鈥檚 what we did.

Just reading through another reply to you. I have not found any direct flights to Valencia from NY/NJ airports. When I first went to look at the house I got to Valencia by changing planes in Frankfurt. That airport is huge and it was at least 40 minutes to get to the connecting flights. From NY/NJ there are direct flights to Madrid or Barcelona. In December when we go we鈥檙e flying into Madrid. Both airports are about a four hour drive. Google maps work and the roads are good.

@Mbershod,

I will continue to encourage you.

My 17 year old cat鈥攖he love of my life that I鈥檝e had since she was 4 months old鈥攄oes not like change,

and will pace for 20 minutes if I move a piece of furniture. She was my primary concern. But she was a real

trouper, and made the trip just fine (never complained). We did a 10-hour flight from LAX to Amsterdam with

a one-hour layover, then a 1-hour flight to Valencia. We stayed in an Air BnB for 2 weeks until I found an apt.

& she is settled in & grateful to have stopped traveling I鈥檓 sure. During the flight I took her (in her carrier) to

the bathroom & took her out so she could stretch (she also has arthritis in her hip). I had bought a travel litter box

that folds up & took a small baggie of silica litter (which I don鈥檛 normally use, but keeping weight limits in mind, it鈥檚

very lightweight) & just unfolded the litter box during each trip to the bathroom, but she never used it. I knew she wouldn鈥檛.

I also DID NOT medicate her to sedate her鈥攕edation can interrupt their ability to regulate their temperature. I would not

have made this trip if I couldn鈥檛 take her with me.

I picked Valencia arbitrarily just from what I read about it: I don鈥檛 know anyone here, and the Spanish I spoke 35 years

ago I鈥檝e since forgotten. I know about 20 words. And I鈥檓 doing just fine. Any of the places you鈥檝e mentioned have large

ex-pat communities & as long as you鈥檙e not in some rural village, at least some English will be understood by shops & vendors.

Between my poor Spanish & they鈥檙e little English (usually better than my Spanish), we understand each other. And there is

Google Translate which you can download on your phone. A huge learning curve? You bet. And a ton of work (organization with paperwork & sorting out what to get rid of & what to take & what to ship), but so worth it. The whole experience continues to expand my mind and intellect. I鈥檓 so glad I made this move.

Wow, now that is encouraging鈥�Interesting that you didn鈥檛 medicate her but I completely understand, plus there are some natural remedies that might do the trick. Did you feed her during the trip? I would be so afraid to take our Sophie out of her carrier as she always finds that perfect place to hide.聽 聽Can you tell me roughly what the cost was to ship whatever stuff you decide to take? Really do appreciate the encouragement 馃榿

@njadwriter

My dad is a new expat (he joined me in Bulgaria via Family Reunification a few months ago)... and he's 97 next week.

@Mbershod

I always have the same worry about secret holes & spaces she can find, but there is absolutely no place to hide in the bathroom on the plane鈥攋ust make sure the toilet seat is down of course.

I didn鈥檛 let her get on the filthy floor either鈥擨 placed her on the counter & basically held onto her lightly, just so

she could move around a bit.

As for shipping by sea freight: I had one 5X4 armoire & 49 small to medium boxes鈥攊t all came to 190 cuft

(which is how sea freight is evidently measured)鈥攖hey go by volume, not weight. This came to $3100.

@Mbershod

As for feeding her鈥攊t鈥檚 discouraged to feed them during & several hours prior to the flight in case

they get motion sickness. Water is ok, although mine didn鈥檛 even want to drink.

I did try to see if she鈥檇 eat a few pieces of kibble, but she wasn鈥檛 interested.

I鈥檓 pretty sure they鈥檙e too stressed to eat or use the litter box during the trip. Everyone I鈥檝e spoken to

& every account I鈥檝e read of people that have traveled on a long flight have said the same: their cats

weren鈥檛 interested in eating or using the litter box during the flight. Once we got to the AirBnB, she did

use the litter box, ate & drank water.

Yes, chamomile is one natural way to go that is supposed to be safe and effective for calming cats down.

I haven鈥檛 heard of any cats flipping out during travel to be honest. I

There is a woman who relocated to France from the U.S. at age 70 a few years ago.

Google 鈥淛anice in France鈥�.

And gwynj says his Dad is a new expat at age 96!

@rdruby699. Thanks again for all the info. How did you decide on Valencia? We visited twice last year, mainly looking west of Malaga but it was really hot there in June. Thinking maybe just outside of Alicante would be better

@Mbershod

I think most of Spain is very hot in the summer, so I doubt it makes much difference to be in Alicante/Valencia or Tarragona/Barcelona instead of Marbella/Malaga. If anywhere's cooler, maybe the other coast (Bilboa way), or up in the mountains. I was at 1,500m in the Pyrenees for a couple of years, and summer is still hot, but definitely a few degrees cooler than Alicante. Personally, I find the best way to deal with Spain's summers is to have good AC units (and generous home insulation, ideally) or take a long vacation somewhere cooler. :-)

@Mbershod

It was a stab in the dark really.

I had spoken to numerous people that loved Valencia,

and a few that had moved here from the states.

I knew I didn鈥檛 want to be further south, because while yes,

most of Spain gets really hot during the summer, the further

south you go, (reportedly) the hotter it gets, including Alicante, Malaga & Murcia,

& especially Andalusia, Cadiz & Sevilla. Good reliable AC will be key

during the summer, and probably venturing out after the sun goes down.

@rdruby699

Adjusting your daily schedule definitely helps a lot. My summer morning walks are typically 5am or thereabouts as that's usually the coolest time of the day. Evenings are warmer, but still much better for exercising than during the day.

Well I think I鈥檓 ready to make the move鈥�I don鈥檛 foresee things getting better here in the States with the results of this past election.聽 We will probably start to get our things in order but we still have to sell our condo and the timing will be crucial due to Spain鈥檚 tax on capital gains.聽 Appreciate all the info and inspiration

@Mbershod

Yes, strike while the irons hot. Best of luck!

If you have any further questions feel free to DM me 馃槉

Totally agree with gwynj on adjusting one鈥檚 daily schedule, especially if

you鈥檙e heat intolerant.

@rdruby699 Quick question- did you get your NLV? If so what steps did you take? We have been told that you have to apply here in the states, then we would have to fly back if it鈥檚 approved

@Mbershod

Yes, I am in Spain on a NLV.

And yes, you will need to apply for it in the U.S.鈥攜ou will need to turn in your documents in

person to wherever your Spanish consulate is鈥� I think you鈥檙e in Florida? I know there鈥檚 a consulate

in Miami鈥攏ot sure if there鈥檚 one on the west coast. Keep in mind that once you turn in your documents,

the consulate can request that you come in for an interview (that didn鈥檛 happen for me, but they can), so

best to get the ball rolling while you鈥檙e in the U.S. Also, I used a Spanish immigration lawyer. There are

differing opinions on this鈥攎any people do the visa process on their own, and even if you have a lawyer,

you will do all the footwork with regard to compiling the (voluminous) amount of paperwork. With that said,

it was comforting to know that I had a legal professional proofreading my documents to make sure they were

accurate (you will NOT want to do this twice, trust me). And if for any reason my visa was denied, they would help

me with the appeal process. Basically it was hand-holding, but totally worth the money. Just a suggestion.

Thanks again. So you applied here in the States for the visa, right? And once it was approved did you then have a certain amount to time in which you had to travel to Spain? I believe it鈥檚 90 days?

@Mbershod

Yes, the visa process was done before I moved to Spain鈥擨 wanted to make sure it was approved before undertaking all the other planning & rigamarole needed, like the documentation needed to fly my cat over with me, packing, shipping, making living arrangements for the first month here in Spain, etc.

Once your visa is approved, that鈥檚 when I would suggest locking in your flight (you need to make your reservations by phone if you are bringing your cat in the cabin, because there is a limit on all airlines with regard to how many pets they鈥檒l allow in the

cabin鈥攊f that allotment has already been met for that flight, your cat won鈥檛 be allowed on, & you can鈥檛 do this online).

Timing will be key for bringing your cat: if your cat is already chipped (there is a specific type chip that鈥檚 required) & their rabies

vaccine is current, great. If not, as in my case, I had to have cat chipped & vaxxed. There is a 21-day waiting period after they鈥檙e chipped & vaxxed (that how long it takes for the inoculation period) before they can fly. Then, you need to have a USDA certified veterinarian sign a document verifying the animal is properly chipped & vaxxed: this one is important: you need to fly into Spain within 10 days of the date on that signed USDA document, otherwise it won鈥檛 be accepted.

So, you need to know your visa is approved.

You鈥檒l need airline reservations for you & your cat鈥攜es, your cat will actually be on your airline ticket.

You鈥檒l need lodging arrangements in Spain.

You need to figure out what to pack & bring with you, & if you鈥檙e going to ship items鈥攊f so, shipping arrangements should be

made at least a month prior to departure with a shipping company (you definitely don鈥檛 want to ship by air: $$$$$).

Get your cat鈥檚 paperwork in order鈥攜ou鈥檒l need to find a USDA certified veterinarian that can handle the required paperwork鈥�

not all vets do, mainly because it鈥檚 a pain in the neck due to the amount of paperwork. Make sure the airline cat carrier is airline-specific compliant: I can tell you for sure that Iberia鈥檚 dimension requirements are different from KLM鈥檚.

Hope this helps.

@rdruby699聽 This is what makes me so uneasy, having to have all the dates in place. The part about having the cat chipped (ours is but not sure of the type) and vaxxed and then getting the USDA approval all in alignment with airline tickets鈥�.One question, I thought that in order to get the NLV you need to already have a rental agreement or have purchased a property? Is that not the case?

Again I appreciate all the info you鈥檙e providing

@Mbershod

No, that is not the case. Some consulates have been known to require having an address in the location you鈥檙e moving to, while others just want to know what city you鈥檙e moving to (the L.A. consulate for example).

Check the website of your particular consulate鈥攁ll of their requirements are right there.

I kept a list of all the requirements, and then either highlighted or bullet pointed any that were 1) time sensitive;

2) needed to be translated; 3) needed to be apostilled or notarized.

The first requirement to get done is the FBI background check because it takes the longest.

Find out now if your cat needs to re-chipped or vaccinated. You鈥檙e not going to Spain in the

next 3 weeks, so you have plenty of time to address your cat鈥檚 chip & vax status.

The chip & vax (if your cat even needs it) needs to be done at least 21 days *before* travel.

Find a way of organizing the requirements that works for you.

This is not an easy process, but tons of people (including myself) have done it鈥攜ou can as well. 馃槉

One major hiccup we have is that Spain taxes you on capital gains from the sale of a property here in the States so the timing of that is a bit of a conundrum.聽 To avoid that we wouldn鈥檛 be able to close on a deal until July if we plan on moving this year.聽 And the other conundrum is that the lease on our car is up in January.聽 Sigh鈥�

@Mbershod

Yes, you definitely have to consider your tax liability with capital gains, so timing would be key.

As for the car, yes, leasing contracts can be notoriously expensive to get out of.

Sounds like you might want to consult an immigration lawyer with regard to the timing of the condo sale.

I don鈥檛 think I can post any specific names in this public forum鈥擨 used a very reputable Spanish law firm based

in Barcelona鈥攊f you鈥檇 like their name, feel free to DM me & I can give your their name.

GM鈥�.Not sure how to DM you but here is my email address: ***

then the other thing we need to think about is once in Spain we would need a car鈥︷煠︹�嶁檧锔�

@Mbershod

Hello to dm someone, click on his photo then on "send a message"

Regards

Bhavna

@gwynj

I understand your reluctance. It's a big move. I have spent 10 years intermittenly,聽 exchanging my NYC apt.for a few months at a time,聽 for one in Barcelona.

All in different neigborhoods, plus visiting nearby village like Sitges and those along the Costa Brave north of BCN.

This has given me a good idea in which neighborhood I want to live, definitly聽 in the city of Barcelona, as I am an urban person and single, but like you older and retired. I suggest you do the same, explore all the areas you're interested in and聽 if possible spend a month or two each, before you buy something.